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General Discussion of viewers, this section is not intended for technical support of viewer bugs, but more a general area for Viewer discussion and announcements for all users and third party viewer teams.



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 Post subject: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:37 am 
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This Thread is a simple "Features, Functions & Capability list" of things for OpenSim in regards to viewers and ongoing compatibility & support. This is by no means the complete list of items but rather a discussion of what is presently available and items for consideration for Viewer Developer's who wish to support OpenSimulator fully.

Grid Selection:
This is the obvious ;)

Building:
Large Linksets greater than 255 prims
Prim Sizes from 0.001m to 256.0m
Hollows to 99%

Scripting:
Over 100 osFunctions and their related Constants.
Scripting Highlights and related hover texts should be included.
(Scripters make the world move & function)
See my signature...

WindLight/Lightshare:
OpenSim implemented Lightshare prior to LL implementing their Windlight from region capability.
The Windlight functionality is also supported by OpenSim as well as Lightshare.
Viewer's should be able to set the Windlight settings to be displayed to visitors.
Viewer's should be able to use the Parcel WindLight Region Settings to complete the immersion.

HyperGrid jumping:
Similar to SLURL, there is HOP and HG.
There seems to be some inconsistency between viewers, a formal standard should be adopted and applied. OpenSimulator Org or Overte Foundation or Viewer Developer agreement whichever does the trick.

Export/Import:
  • This is an important feature especially in OpenSimulator as not everyone is able to obtain OAR or IAR files.
  • XML exports/imports work fine but there seems to be some confusion in regards to licencing.
  • HPA exports/imports work fine but apparently only 1 V3 viewer supports it (Angstrom, Astra), possible license issues. Original implementor was Patrick Sapinski (aka K/O/W of Meerkat & Astra viewer).
  • ** HPA does prim contents such as scripts, notecards but not objects within objects. This is superior to XML in that regard. The originator (Liferain.com) of the HPA specification is no longer online or available.

EDIT (April.2013)
As of the edit date above, Singularity Viewer & Avination have collaborated to bring Export Perm functionality into OpenSim & the Viewer. This step is certainly in the right direction and should be considered for future Viewer Development for Best Interest of everyone using OpenSimulator and the ever expanding Hypergrid + . While Singularity is a V1 UI based off Snowglobe with advanced features & functionality, this should be looked at for V3 based Viewers as well.

**Origination of Export Permissions Concept Reference

I have possibly missed some things (likely did) so feel free to add any "current features or functions" that should be supported by a viewer in OpenSim.

Please DO NOT add new feature / function requests or ideas here as this is for what is currently in OpenSim.

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Last edited by WhiteStar Magic on Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:00 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:52 pm 
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Joined: Sun Nov 28, 2010 5:09 pm
Posts: 444
Coordinates

I would add teleporting distance within a sim. For instance most SL viewers have a limit of teleporting up to 4096, but imprudence and some of the others have raised this to higher levels, mainly to 10,000 meters. Also the original SL viewer had the limit of editing and rezzing objects at 4096 meters, but imprudence and other viewers have raised this limit to 10,000 also. This can be demonstrated by rezzing a prim above 4096, if you try to move it and the viewer is not configured the prim will jump from where you are to 4096.

I've noticed that when I tried to teleport to a skybox I had put at 5000 meters using Firestorm, it would always deposit me below this at 4096 and I would fall to earth, so apparently it has not been fixed yet.

And regarding Mega Regions, the problems of Rezzing and working on builds outside the regular 256 X 256 has been addressed by imprudence and some others, but needs to be included for future viewers too. Same problem there is prims jump to the nearest 256 coordinate if the viewer is not adjusted for larger coordinates.

And from what I understand the problem with Hypergriding to a region that is more than 4096 or 2048 spaces is hard coded in the viewers themselves...so hopefully someone can track down that "oversight" by the Lindens and get a work around implemented in future viewers.


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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 3:51 am 
{L_QUOTE}:
Viewer's should be able to set the Windlight settings to be displayed to visitors.
Viewer's should be able to use the Parcel WindLight Region Settings to complete the immersion.


Happily this is now working for most V3 based viewers, it's accessed via the estate controls environment tab.
The real challenge and better option is to impliment Lightshare though...this is far superior to presets and allows infinite possiblities to create moods and lighting effects... Sadly there was something that was stopping this being used in V3 code....I think there was an old forum discussion on this...perhaps things have changed..hope so.


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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 5:02 am 
Just found that Firestorm can actually save your own personal presets to the server..so effectively gives us what was Lightshare. This should work on other current V3's also...


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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:52 pm 
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So what viewers are actually left for OpenSim ?

- Singularity V1+ -UI SL ? / OS
- Cool VL Viewer V1+ UI (SL & OS)
- Firestorm/OS V3 UI (outdated 2012)
- Angstrom V3 UI (outdated Jan.2013)
- Zen (removed)
- Astra (removed)
- Imprudence V1 Base (outdated / ancient)
- Kokua V3 UI (SL? / OS?) ??
- ????

- PixieViewer Web-based viewer in development, Alpha V2.0. OS Only !
-RadeGast (unique viewer) OS, SL ?

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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 9:11 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 8:01 pm
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WhiteStar Magic {L_WROTE}:
So what viewers are actually left for OpenSim ?

- Singularity V1+ -UI SL ? / OS
- Cool VL Viewer V1+ UI (SL & OS)
- Firestorm/OS V3 UI (outdated 2012)
- Angstrom V3 UI (outdated Jan.2013)
- Zen (removed)
- Astra (removed)
- Imprudence V1 Base (outdated / ancient)
- Kokua V3 UI (SL? / OS?) ??
- ????

- PixieViewer Web-based viewer in development, Alpha V2.0. OS Only !
-RadeGast (unique viewer) OS, SL ?


Not sure I'd classify Firestorm or Angstrom "outdated". More to the point, I'm running a test release of the New FS for Opensimulator, it runs fantastic, has several new features including XML export/import, and repairs to several line items (such as prim clamp size) that were in place on the original release. Cinder from FS has been finishing up the final touches and it should be out in the next couple weeks. As for Angstrom - how is 3 mos old "outdated"?

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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 9:27 pm 
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Walter Balazic {L_WROTE}:
Not sure I'd classify Firestorm or Angstrom "outdated". More to the point, I'm running a test release of the New FS for Opensimulator, it runs fantastic, has several new features including XML export/import, and repairs to several line items (such as prim clamp size) that were in place on the original release. Cinder from FS has been finishing up the final touches and it should be out in the next couple weeks. As for Angstrom - how is 3 mos old "outdated"?


Why quote what I wrote. That is redundant.
The Question was / is simple. What is serviceable, up to date & ongoing ?

Angstrom is static and out of date, I use it though. Code Updates are fast & furious everywhere else.

Current FS for OS is 3+ months out. I do read their blog & source code, know what is happening.
Will their "new XML" be any better than the previous XML import/export ?
Compatible with previous XML format ? (hope so, there is TONS of XML archives in circulation)
Will it also have the Export Perms facility being co-developed by Avination & Siungularity ??
As for Cinder... I pulled all my OSSL patches out of all repos. No accrediting, no free lunch, it's all hers now eh!

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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:08 pm 
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????=Lumiya


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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 8:35 am 
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Posts: 444
Thanks Arielle, Yes Lumyia Viewer for Android Devices.

Totally forgot about that one, partly because I don't own any devices that could use it. According to their WIKI it can be used for OpenSim and has limited functionality which is no surprise because of what it is. All Good. :)

WS

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 Post subject: Re: OpenSim Features & Compatibility for Viewers
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:30 am 

Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:04 pm
Posts: 12
I've been using Kokua recently and it meets most of the objectives in your list of ideal functionality.

Currently missing features;
- link sets are currently capped at 255 (but all the other build functionality is there)
- does not support parcel windlight (afaik only Firestorm does currently) but does fully support it at region level
- OSSL functions + constants are included but without hover help (does any viewer have hover help for OSSL?)
- not sure about XML export capabilities (I usually make oars)

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